Magonia, Sky Ships, and Alien Pancakes: Exploring Ancient UFO Folklore
Wondering Monsters Podcast, Episode 31: Magonia, Sky Ships, and Alien Pancakes: Exploring Ancient UFO Folklore |
Monster Ranking: 2.5 Monsters
The Medieval Legend of Magonia
The discussion begins with one of the oldest recorded stories associated with Magonia, a mysterious sky realm mentioned in 9th century France. According to medieval writings by a bishop named Agobard of Lyon, local villagers believed that supernatural weather magicians called "Tempestarii" worked alongside beings from the sky kingdom of Magonia. These sky visitors allegedly used storms to steal crops from the fields below.
The villagers believed the Tempestarii could either summon destructive storms or prevent them in exchange for payment. This created tension with the church because local farmers were allegedly paying these weather sorcerers instead of properly tithing. The bishop’s writings describe an incident where four supposed "Magonians" — three men and one woman — were captured by villagers who claimed the individuals had fallen from the sky.
The crowd intended to stone the prisoners, believing they were literal sky people connected to these supernatural crop thefts. However, the bishop intervened and stopped the execution, insisting the captives were ordinary humans rather than visitors from another realm.
Despite the bishop’s skepticism, the story survived for over a thousand years and became one of the foundational legends tied to Magonia. The hosts of the podcast discuss how bizarrely modern the story sounds, especially considering its themes of aerial visitors, mysterious technologies, weather manipulation, and strange interactions with rural communities.
Cloud Ships and Sky Sailors
One of the most fascinating elements of the Magonia legend is the concept of cloud ships. According to folklore, the inhabitants of Magonia traveled through the sky in vessels resembling boats or airships. These stories appear repeatedly throughout medieval Europe and Ireland.
The episode highlights a famous Irish tale often called the Cloera Church Incident. In this story, a flying ship sailed through the clouds when its anchor became tangled on a church roof. Witnesses allegedly saw a sailor climb down from the vessel as though swimming through water. The sailor struggled as if drowning in the atmosphere while attempting to free the anchor.
A clergyman supposedly ordered the crowd to let the sailor go, after which the mysterious figure floated back upward toward the ship. Depending on the version of the tale, the crew either freed the anchor or cut it loose before disappearing back into the sky.
The hosts discuss how strange these stories are because the witnesses clearly understood what boats looked like. Medieval people were familiar with wood, metal, sails, and anchors. Yet the stories describe literal sailing ships floating in the sky rather than vaguely shaped flying objects.
This raises one of the central questions explored throughout the episode: were people genuinely seeing impossible craft, or were they attempting to interpret something beyond their understanding using familiar imagery?
Ancient UFOs or Symbolic Visions?
As the discussion progresses, the hosts begin comparing Magonia folklore to modern UFO encounters. They note that the descriptions of mysterious aerial craft seem to evolve alongside human technology and cultural expectations.
In medieval Europe, the sky visitors traveled in boats because boats represented advanced transportation technology. By the late 1800s, witnesses in the United States described cigar-shaped airships with propellers and dirigible-like features decades before modern aircraft became common.
The podcast explores the famous 1896–1897 American airship wave, during which numerous witnesses reported silent flying machines drifting across the skies. Some accounts included strange occupants, bizarre mechanical details, and impossible behavior.
The hosts argue that these stories often contain details that feel "almost believable" but ultimately make little practical sense. For example, some airship stories involve ropes, anchors, and primitive technologies despite supposedly advanced flying capabilities.
This leads into broader discussions about the nature of paranormal encounters. Are these beings literal extraterrestrials? Are they interdimensional tricksters? Are they projections created by the human mind attempting to interpret something incomprehensible?
The podcast references the work of French UFO researcher Jacques Vallée, particularly his influential book Passport to Magonia. Vallée proposed that UFO encounters share deep similarities with older folklore involving fairies, spirits, goblins, and supernatural beings.
According to Vallée’s theory, modern alien encounters may simply be contemporary versions of ancient mythological experiences shaped by cultural expectations.
The Alien Pancake Encounter
One of the strangest stories discussed in the episode is the famous "alien pancake" encounter of 1961. A Wisconsin chicken farmer named Joe Simonton allegedly encountered a landed UFO near his property. According to Simonton, several short humanoid figures emerged from the craft and cooked pancakes on a flameless grill.
The beings reportedly handed Simonton a strange pancake-like food item before departing. The pancake was later examined by authorities and determined to contain buckwheat, though curiously no salt was present.
The hosts find the absurdity of the story fascinating. Why would technologically advanced extraterrestrials stop to cook pancakes? Why would they resemble short, stocky men rather than stereotypical "gray aliens"? Why did they wear simple one-piece outfits with knit caps?
These bizarre details become central to the discussion. The hosts repeatedly return to the idea that paranormal stories contain elements that feel intentionally strange or symbolically distorted. The encounters are never fully logical, yet they are oddly consistent across time and cultures.
The episode also humorously connects the alien pancakes back to the Magonia legends involving stolen crops, root vegetables, and agricultural products. The hosts jokingly speculate that sky beings may have always been interested in Earth’s food supply.
Folklore, Tricksters, and Perception
Throughout the episode, the hosts explore recurring themes found in folklore and UFO reports alike. Many encounters involve strange humanoids wearing outdated or ill-fitting clothing, impossible technologies that resemble familiar objects, and events that appear dreamlike or symbolic rather than mechanical.
The discussion compares these beings to fairy folklore, leprechauns, wild men, goblins, Men in Black, and other trickster figures that seem designed to confuse or unsettle witnesses.
The hosts also consider psychological explanations. Perhaps human perception itself distorts encounters with unknown phenomena. If the brain encounters something it cannot fully process, it may unconsciously substitute familiar imagery — turning incomprehensible objects into boats, cigars, or humanoid figures.
At the same time, the podcast acknowledges that many witnesses had little to gain by sharing these bizarre stories. Farmers, police officers, religious figures, and ordinary people often risked ridicule by reporting strange encounters.
This tension between absurdity and sincerity becomes one of the episode’s central mysteries.
Close Encounters and Modern Paranormal Theory
The conversation eventually shifts toward modern UFO classifications and paranormal theories. The hosts discuss the concept of "Close Encounters of the Fifth Kind," often associated with contemporary UFO researcher Steven Greer.
They explain the various categories of close encounters, ranging from simple UFO sightings to direct communication with extraterrestrial entities. The episode briefly touches on occult figures like Aleister Crowley and rocket pioneer Jack Parsons, exploring the historical overlap between mysticism, ceremonial magic, and UFO culture.
This broader perspective reinforces the episode’s main theme: humanity has always experienced strange sky-related phenomena, but the way we interpret those experiences changes over time.
Final Thoughts on Magonia
The Wondering Monsters Podcast ultimately presents Magonia not as a solved mystery but as an enduring symbol of humanity’s fascination with the unknown. Whether these stories represent misunderstood natural events, psychological phenomena, folklore traditions, extraterrestrial visitors, or something even stranger, they continue to capture imaginations centuries later.
From cloud ships and weather wizards to alien pancakes and cattle thefts, the legends of Magonia demonstrate how deeply rooted sky mysteries are in human storytelling. The episode encourages listeners to think critically while remaining open to the possibility that some mysteries resist easy explanations.
Perhaps the strangest part of all is how consistently these stories repeat across generations, always hovering just beyond the edge of credibility.
Links from the Show
- Hellhounds in Mythology & Folklore
- Nessie Cryptid History: The Truth Behind the Loch Ness Monster
- Leprechauns: Real History of Irish Folklore, Fairy Law, and Hidden Treasure
- Mothman and a Horrific Bridge Collapse
- Crop Circles Explained?
Watch & Listen to the Full Episode
Enjoy where the conversations of silly meet strange at the Wondering Monsters Podcast.
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Licensing Information
- Title: Entry of the Gladiators
- Composer: Julius Fučík
- Library of Congress (Public Domain)
- Podcast theme song version edited/arranged/mixed by Dan Swift
Unless indicated, images appear in their original form.
Images were generated using AI from MyNinja.ai, NightCafe, lenso.ai, Gemini, or ChatGPT
Transcription
*Transcription was automatically generated and may contain errors.(Music)
Baba: 1407 France, you guys want to talk about Magonia?
WDG: Do you jump in too fast, Dan?
Danny C: No, we're good. Let's fly on over, plant those seeds, and harvest what we got.
Baba: There's no need talking about consensus reality today, because that doesn't make any sense, but this stuff, this makes more sense. We could even go back further, but let's go to Magonia itself. I have so many notes missing, like, the main story of Magonia right here, but we're going to get to it.
WDG: I think it has something to do with weather wizards. I have to say, I previously, to us talking about talking about this, I had no idea what the hell that was, you know, so…
Baba: Yeah, so the story is that of these… So there are these people in a village, and there's a bishop that's overseeing these people in this village. He's writing this story. It's the one story that all of Magonia, by that name, goes back to. And he's writing this thing, his frustration, of these townsfolk that aren't tithing properly, jerks.
WDG: Worse.
Baba: And the reason they're not tithing properly, according to this writing, is because they've been paying off these tempestari, these wizards, that work with these sky wizards, or sky beings, that live in this place called Magonia. The people in Magonia, they want root crops. To make their pancakes, I'll come back to that. You can make some interesting pancakes out of, like, carrots and sweet potatoes. And things like that, probably any root crop you can mash up and cook. You can…
WDG: So is this tied… Go ahead, go ahead. I was going to say, is this tied into the origin of the pancake? Is that where we're going? There's a…
Baba: Let's not get ahead or behind of ourselves, because we'll get even more confused. But… So, these sky wizards want root crops. And the obvious reason is because you can't plant much in the sky when it comes to root crops. I mean, you have access to the sun. You can do, like, a lot of… You can do, like, potted vegetable gardens in the sky. But not much in the way of, like, ones that really… Really well get that tarroir. And I do think this is happening in France, so I had to mispronounce the French word right in the beginning. They're paying off these wizards because the wizards are keeping the… They're making deals with these people in the sky to keep storms from happening. They're destroying their crops. And that's going to help them out to make some money, which they then use to pay off these wizards. And you see how this economy's working. It's not good for the church. But these people wind up getting four individuals. I believe it is three men and one woman. And they put them in a cage and they're going to stone them because they're like, "These MF-ers are Meganian people. They're Meganians. They fell to the earth from the sky." Anyway, so they have these guys and a girl in a cage and the bishop comes to stop them from killing them. Because they say they're from the sky realm. I don't know what their evidence was. They could successfully build a bridge out of them or they weighed the same as a duck. I don't know. I don't know how they figured it out.
WDG: Well, I mean, like, here's like a weird thing. It's like, "Did they sell them like, come from the sky?" Or like, "Maybe they were like working on a roof or something." And they were like, "They must have come from the sky." Like, it's like… I mean, like… Or maybe like…
Baba: Or they looked like those characters in the Timothy Lynch or the David Lynch…
WDG: Before… I don't want to propose… I don't want to propose… Get too far ahead of, you know, things. But like, do you think maybe…
Baba: They don't kill these people, by the way. Anyone that's in suspense. They're okay.
WDG: Yeah. Well, now you're ruined, dude. Do you think maybe these people showed up… I'm from the future. You're saying like, this was a scam that was basically happening in a bunch of villages. Like, a bunch of villages weren't paying tithing, right? And this particular village, maybe these people showed up. And they were just like, "Yeah, pay the… "Magonian protection money." And those people were like, "No." And they just… Like, they locked them in jail. Like, they like… They just, you know, were like, "Yeah, we caught them." We caught them, you know, it's like they just… You know, because that was like… They were just running a Magonian scam. Like, I mean, maybe they were Magonians. That old Magonian scam. Yeah, it's like…
Danny C: So racketeering, that goes back to like the 1300s. And it doesn't originate with humans, is what you're saying. I finally got a date, by the way.
Baba: This is 815. This is 815. This goes back to…
WDG: I imagine racketeering goes back before the common era, but that's… I think just a little place called Rome, and I'm sure there was lots of racketeering there.
Baba: Yeah. Well, yeah, so… So, but in this case… So the bishop shows up and he's like, "Yo, no, you're not going to kill these people. These are normal people. They need to tithe." All that's needed here is they need to tithe, and so do you for trying to… You know, God's very upset with you for trying to kill these people. And so they send them on their way. And that's Magonia. Okay, that's the one thing that's… Now, Magonia is supposed to be… Well, you didn't talk about the
WDG: cloudships, you know, specifically, lately, you know.
Baba: Well, we're going to talk more about cloudships because they go to… They're associated with Magonia-like places, but not necessarily by that name. But it's basically the same thing. Okay, so the Magonians get around on these cloudships that are basically like what we would think of as like… Kind of similar to like airships. Like, if you think about how they're rendered in like steampunk stuff or in some of the earlier Final Fantasy stuff, or they're basically… Or Mario Brothers. They're boats that float in the sky. And we've got one in the year 1211. It's called the… And there's a little confusion over the names on this. I'll have to get some clarification. Folks, you know how it rocks? Go into the comments. We're talking about the skies above, but go into the comments below and leave us your wisdom. You're smarter than us. Well, than me. I won't speak for these two. (Audience Laughing) The Cleora Church Incident, also known as the Plan Mac Noire. You've heard me do this. If not, check out our previous stuff. Can't promise it's better, for folks that our future stuff is. Yeah, because it's Ireland. It certainly looks like a French word to mispronounce, but Cleora, I believe is the Irish word. So this is something Ireland. In Ireland.
WDG: Okay.
Baba: A ship going through the sky like a boat. Okay. Going through the sky, like with an anchor, that gets caught on the church. And people see this going on, because like church itself sucks. They're hanging out outside. (Audience Applauding) It's like, oh man, I've heard this hobby before. This just goes, oh, let's go out and catch a smoke. And here's this boat and the anchor gets caught on it. And somebody swims down to try to free the anchor. And people interfere and interact with this character somehow. I don't know if they climb up on the roof somehow, or a small church. Q on the roof music. Oh, we don't have the copyright access to that. And they try to, I guess they're trying to get these people or free the anchor. At which point the guy goes, I'm drowning. And then some clergy member comes up, I'm miss telling this. This is just how these stories go people. So clergy member comes out and says, let that guy go. And then the guy floats up back into the boat. And then I believe cuts the anchor and leaves. Now I say, I believe cuts the anchor because there are like several tellings of this story. It's associated at least with two places, Cloeira, that might be the one in Ireland, Clonmagnuat, which might not be based on that name. But it's the same basic story. And sometimes the anchor is remade into the metal hardware of the church, maybe the doors. And, but you've got this story and you've got many stories of boats and sky sailors and people swimming through the sky as though it is water. And it just goes on for a while. Like- Let me go for just one second.
Danny C: Please. This place in Ireland, and I don't remember which episode we talked about it. And you know names, names are like the worst part of my brain. Like names are crap for me. I cannot remember names for anything. (Laughing)
Baba: The name is just such a strange part of the brain.
Danny C: It is. So Timmy, this is what I think. (Laughing) The episode we talked about, there's a place in Ireland, I believe it was a church burned down or caught, I think it was a Hellhounds episode. Okay. Uh-huh. Is that the same general area as either of these places in Ireland? Do you know off the top of your head or are they like completely separated by vast distances? I feel like
Baba: there's a church that burns down and has all the zombies associated with it. There's a wizard and all that stuff. That one is a Belescan House, which I believe is now open for tours. I think they finished the reconstruction. So don't burn it down. Nobody do it, okay? So the question is- If that fuel is ever available again, then maybe I'll get to visit it.
Danny C: So the question is, is it close to Belescan House, do you know? Like this area, or you're not sure?
Baba: Belescan House is right off a Loch Ness. So I just go- Oh, oh. Yeah, so it's definitely not right near it. But geographically speaking, kind of close. Yeah, so this thing about people swimming through the sky. There's a 17th century story of these air sailors in England. Thanks for not giving me a name on that AI. It's so stupid.
Danny C: Just make one up. That's what I do all the time.
Baba: Yeah. (Audience Laughing) The, there is an airship. Okay, so, so they're the ones that look like boats, okay? And there's swimmers through the sky, okay? And that's like appropriate to the technology people would have been familiar with at the time. Okay? I'm gonna come back to that, okay? Cause we've got this airship wave in the United States in the 1896, 1897. They look like cigars, dirigibles. They've got propellers on them. Okay. So they're like blimps, blimps, like dirigibles. That's very similar. I believe there's a minor distinction. Exemplins. Of course, I don't know what it is. (Laughing) Yeah, exactly. Like these kinds of things, okay? They're basically some kind of balloon type thing in a basket attached, but not balloons. They've got propellers on them. Help us out. Either of you folks, if you're faster on it or anyone in the chat, yeah, in the chat, cause this is totally live. Go ahead and let us know in the comments the big differences. And when were airships really a thing? And I mean, when were blimps like a real thing?
WDG: We were, post the golden age of ballooning, you know?
Baba: Yeah. But these things just showing up hovering around, moving silently.
WDG: Which I believe ballooning starts in France. So there you go. Maybe a-- Yeah, connection. Maybe begonians are just the Wizard of Oz. See God float off the court.
Baba: Also like the most diabolical of like grimoire stuff and everything also France. So I think it's a connection here.
WDG: So could have balloon wizards is what you're saying. Like, again, like I said, Wizard of Oz, balloon is a wizard coincidence, you know? And there are these-- Anaconda artist. Yeah.
Baba: And I mean, the thing is like, so all this stuff goes throughout time and you've got all the way back to like Anunnaki, which is like this Sumerian kind of idea. And people are gonna be like, you're smearing it all over the place. It's like, well, kind of, but again, we'll come back to it. And then you've got these things. Oftentimes the technology is like right off of what people understand, but it's doing things that don't make sense. Okay, so I want you all to think about the leprechauns. Now they're kind of wearing clothes like people, but there's a variety of sizes all wrong. They're all falling off, but they're also supposed to be cobblers. And like, it's way harder to make a leather shoe than it is to make a shirt. And I can't make either, but am I wrong? Come on. Cobblers and seamstresses, duke it out in the comments. These parasitic algorithms love that stuff, I think. And then make friends, come on. How many of us are out there that are interested in this weird stuff? Not enough. Tell your friends about us. Tell them to subscribe. And you subscribe for all the benefits this brings. But anyway, in the United States, seeing these things that are cigar shaped, hovering around, sometimes they've got propellers and things like that. Alexander Hamilton sees one and people talk about Alexander Hamilton saw one. It's real. Not the same Alexander Hamilton. He dies like a hundred years before.
WDG: Alexander Hamilton? Yeah, pretty sure he got shot.
Baba: That's how these things get all messed up. People are like Alexander Hamilton saw one and it was in the papers. It's like, well, yeah, but like, no, not that Alexander Hamilton. And these are the papers that, you know, at that point, you know, a hundred years also after like Ben Franklin stuff who was involved in the papers. Oftentimes though these things, they have technology that just doesn't make sense. Like we all know that intelligent beings in the sky wouldn't build boats, right? Like to float around in. Cause now we know a little thing about boats and how they work and how the sky works and that it's not water. Cause we've allegedly been up there. You know, I'm not, I almost spoil any kind of future things about the firmament or the flatness or the lack thereof of this great earth. So I don't think we'll probably get into that. So, but that being said, that being said, oftentimes these, the technology is like just out of reach and like just convincing enough. And there are enough similarities between fae encounters and encounters with Magonians and encounters with alien space aliens, extraterrestrial space aliens, or otherwise creatures maybe from a different time. That is not ours. Visiting from some place or time. And they often do these weird things that just don't make sense. Things that almost seem to have a more of a metaphorical or symbolic quality to them. Or some kind of disguise that's just a little bit off. Despite the fact that they seem to be this very advanced magical-ish kind of stock doing these kinds of things that they shouldn't be able to do.
WDG: What we do know about the Magonians is they were straight up like, at least it's according to the local legend, were basically pirates, like thieves. Like they were out to use their weather magic, right? To steal crops or like you said.
Baba: By colluding with earthly people to summon them or something. Yeah, like there's some kind of collusion. They had something to do with these earth people. Why did they need the earth people?
WDG: The one thing I saw though, there was like something like they would use the-- To make sure they're ready. To use the storms to mask or something. One thing I had read was something like they used storms knock down parts of the crops and then mask. They're coming to steal the crops. And it's like, I don't know, that's a weird. Yeah. Apparently they're kind of just, they're vaguely, however it is, they're running some kind of like, like, you know, piracy, I guess.
Baba: Yeah, well, I mean that's, and they've got access to the technology to create storms.
WDG: But they can't grow food.
Baba: Well, because you need the right kind of medium to grow root crops.
WDG: Right. So maybe they're growing like, maybe they've got some kind of like, I don't know, up in their cloud ships have some kind of, I don't know, they can grow like lettuce or something, you know.
Baba: It's easier to grow leaf crops. But they're not, leaf crops are not as calorically dense as root crops.
WDG: They're hydroponic, yeah, like they're doing now.
Baba: Possibly, possibly, right? Yeah, vertical farming and stuff like that. But then, yeah, but what does that do for your roots? Not much. What about you all and these sky visitors? Have you, anything you all want to throw in yet before we continue on to talk about how they talk about Jacques Vallée and passport to Timogonia and his comparisons to the Fae and things like that?
WDG: It doesn't seem to be any, really other parallel kind of thing. Like there's other sky stuff in like folklore or religions and things like that, but like, you know, but they're usually like places or they're like another realm, right? You kind of get there, view the sky or something like, there isn't like a lot of like, but those are like sort of like fixed, well, for lack of a program, like fixed points. They're like a place, you know, like, oh, it's a sky palace or it's a thing. And I mean, it's like, it's whatever, house of the sky, it's where are the, you know, like the souls live up in this sky realm.
Baba: And I believe Bologna itself is supposed to be some kind of a city or realm up there.
WDG: It doesn't seem like, but there doesn't seem to be a lot of cloud ship things coming in like doing this specific type of behavior, like wizards, you know, on cloud ships.
Baba: Yeah, like not this specific type of thing, but there are weird kinds of parallels between this and other things. And that's where, that's one of the things that makes Bologna itself interesting and probably why Jacques Vallée named his book, "Passport to Magonia" itself. Is that, it blends
WDG: this weird-- Was he from a region that kind of, I mean, Jacques Vallée, was he from-- He's French. But yeah, I wonder if he also specifically from like the area where they believed in this Magonia stuff or close to it.
Baba: I don't know, I don't know. He's still around, I think. He's, I don't know if he's still publishing or not, but he's got a ton of stuff out there, which makes this kind of thing actually like really difficult because like you gotta read a lot. You gotta read a lot to like wrap your head around his main point. So I'm always gonna be missing some of them because I haven't read nearly enough to really talk about him himself. But one of the things is like, so you've got this similarity between, one of the things in the Bologna story is you've got, first of all, were these people just normal people? Like how big was the town that they didn't know who these people were? Like no one knew who they were? Who were they? Because sometimes you do have stories of like these like wild man type encounters. There was one I was trying to, I was trying to find. A lot of times these things happen on farms. I'd be interested in your ideas on why. Now some people would say, well, looks like a good place to land. But also then you've got like the USO thing, like the unidentified submerged objects that come out of the water that look like craft, that have blinking lights like UFOs. But do they just look like that because that's what we think they look like? And that's like a theme that is couched in Valet's stuff is that like a lot of times it's these things that are just on the edge of believability, but they kind of don't make sense. Let me tell you the story about this one farmer. And this is the one I couldn't find. There's another story about a farmer later that I'll tie back to my little pancake theme. This farmer goes out into their field and they encounter something out there that I believe is like a, I can't remember if it's like an airship type craft or if it's a UFO or they saw something out there that led them out there. And they encounter this person out there that is dirty. They're wearing clothing that's a little outdated and they're carrying what looks like a musket that doesn't appear like it would work. If I remember in the telling of the story, that detail is included. It doesn't look like it would work. And I was curious about more details on that. Like did it look like it wasn't quite right? Like it was like, it was made like a, someone made a prop of what a musket was supposed to look like, but it wasn't quite right. But this was like in like the 1800s or something like that. This wasn't, I wanna say like it was like a musket was like an outdated, so it might've even been the 20th century because I feel like in the telling, a musket was an outdated thing to be carrying for like somebody that came from the sky. They wouldn't have this antiquated kind of weapon.
WDG: Well, depending on what it is in the 1800s, so like, you know, the more you get to the, you know, like civil war era, by then you've got-- Yeah, post civil war, we have rifling, start having people carrying, like, you know, you have like sidearm, firearms, like you're getting away from like the, you know, black powdered kind of, you know, like pistols, you know, you have charging, you know, like you have already like basically charges that you would use ready made, you know, for your guns. Like there's, there'd be like more, you know, modern kind of actual bullets, like-- Yeah, yeah. That's not just balls.
Danny C: Or even imagine this where it was, suppose that it wasn't a musket at all, something like incredibly more advanced that they're just relating it. Almost like if you had, imagine a laptop from the early 90s and you happen to stumble across an iPad with one of those keyboards that you can dock to it. If it were separated, you might be like, whoa, it's a laptop, but it's clearly broken. The keyboard was separated from the screen. Right, right. But it's not something more advanced and that's just kind of how you're relating it.
Baba: Well, and so that's one of the things, right? So if we go back, let's go all the way back to like--
WDG: Maybe he was a revolutionary war cosplayer, like he got lost or something. Like, yeah. He was like, I'm lost in the woods. He's like, here have a musket.
Baba: In the middle of someone's, lost in the middle of someone's field. Yeah, yeah. And they got there by some craft in the sky.
WDG: They got lost, you know, they were out there, they lost their troop, you know.
Baba: Well, let's go back to a similar idea though, that the Cloeira Church incident, the one where the anchor got stuck and you have the sky swimmers and stuff. So if you reach for the same explanation and you say, well, they were describing it as a boat because boats are what they knew. Yep, but they would say like, let's say it was, but no, but what it really was, everybody was a UFO, a space alien. And for some reason, one of them was doing something that people could confuse with swimming around the thing and saying, I'm drowning. But they didn't describe it as being made of metal. They didn't say it was a boat, but it's made of metal. This isn't like pre-bronze age. They've seen metal. Like, you know, everyone has seen metal. In fact, metal in a lot of human history was more plentiful than paper. They would write things on metal because it was actually cheaper than paper because paper was so hard to make. So they'd seen metal. Why would they say it's a boat? Do you know what I mean? Like, why would they hallucinate a boat?
WDG: Well, so what the heck was the anchor? Like, I mean,
Baba: if it was-- Well, exactly. And that's what I'm saying is like, that's what's, like, lots of things are strange about it. It's not like it would be less strange if it had blinking lights and alien greys or whatever.
WDG: So it was so like aliens. But how did they get their anchor stuck on a church? You know, that kind of seems a little bizarre for, like, it was like, I'm just advanced intergalactic. I've overcome the laws of physics to be able to travel amongst the stars and a biological organism that can do that. You know, so it's like, but I got my anchor stuck.
Baba: Yeah, like, like, outfits from, like, years away or whatever, right? And he crashed into a garage. You know, like, you know, like--
WDG: So this is like, so how are we going to go to the alien-- Crash into a garage. The clumsy alien theory. Look at these hyper-advanced, clumsy aliens. Yeah.
Baba: And so it's like, all right, so let's go to a weird one. Let's go to, should we go to another farmer's story? Maybe not yet. Do you have any strange sky stories to share before, or sky people? Or sky cities? Anyone want to jump in with anything before I--
WDG: What about, like, is this like, you know, one of the weird things with like the wild hunt, right? Like, that's kind of-- Okay, yeah. I mean, like, it's sort of sky, I mean, like, at least regionally, it's not as far off. And time-wise from like, you know, when you're dealing with like 800 or so, it's not that far in the past, you know, where it's like, you know, these kinds of ideas would have been wiped out. And then there's like, you know, obviously like, from that kind of stuff, and like Odin riding stuff that's got, we get Santa Claus, right? He's a sky guy. Sky phenomenon. Yeah. Yeah. Because literally it is like, you know, like related to kind of, you know, Odin riding his chariot with his reindeer, like right through the sky, like it's a big beard guy, you know.
Baba: We won't get into the whole like Santa Claus and the Aminita Baskaria. We'll save that for another time.
WDG: But just like, there's like, there's some sky, you know, like variations of possibly taking stuff or delivering things, you know, depending on.
Baba: Yeah, yeah, it depends. We should do it. Yeah, exactly, yeah. We don't have to get into Krampus again, but that's always a fun. And again, here we go. Wild man, wild man phenomenon. So like that encounter with the musket person. Okay, that's like, and like the dirty people in tattered things that look like they wandered out of wherever, like, but then like they arrive in a strange way or they disappear suddenly or they claim to be from somewhere else. You know, like that kind of stuff, it's very associated with the wild man stories and Bigfoot is it?
WDG: Well, I guess you were gonna go into like Sumeria, like, you know, Beverly. Yeah, the Anunnaki. In Kidu is a wild man from the legend of, you know. Yeah, he can cover to hair. He's Gilgamesh's, you know, companion, but he comes out and he's a crazy like hairy wild man, you know, so.
Baba: Yeah, exactly, exactly. They have these divine assemblies hanging out in the sky, the Anunnaki. In Inuit Legends, we've got these sky cleaners, these cloud cleaners that clean the sky and they have to do with like the weather and stuff like that. And I'm trying to think about associations with weird weather phenomena and UFOs themselves, like, and I mean spacecraft type. I know when we talked about crop circles, there were some associations with that, like weird storms and then here are these crop circles that are left behind. Yeah, the Anunnaki are this weird kind of thing. They're both kind of deities. They're kind of sky deities, but a lot of the symbolism looks like, like when UFO researchers and things look back, they're kind of like, that kind of doesn't look like what we're used to. That looks more like sky stuff. But there's this ever present problem of projection when it comes to all this stuff, where it's kind of like, are we seeing what's there or are we projecting onto it something? Like are we projecting something onto it that's not quite right because we don't know any better. We projecting something onto it that's not quite right because there's something there and we don't understand it. And something in us is trying to convey something that it's not quite right. It's not quite this, you know?
WDG: Well, the captured Magonians, like this is round it back, right? They didn't seem to be weird or anything according to like, right? Like at least a little bit that was wrong.
Baba: They were strange to the people who captured them. No one seemed to know who they were.
Danny C: Does it say how they got captured?
WDG: No. Yeah, we can, we haven't just been like wandering, you know, merchants or something.
Baba: And they were dirty. That was like another, that's another thing that like links it up with the
WDG: wild man stuff. Everything's sort of dirty then, I don't know. I mean, like I just-- Then
Baba: why would it be noted that they were dirty?
WDG: Yeah, it's kind of weird. Like, it's just like, oh man, these people aren't real. Yeah. It's like, this is not a like, you know, we're not even like, you know, it's not like culture that like that time period and--
Baba: Like we only have the one writing from that Bishop. Right. So it's not like there are like other noteworthy investigations.
WDG: Yeah, so like maybe these people were just like people, like just dirty people that got wandered into town or something, I guess, got captured in hours. Or maybe they were like thieves or something.
Baba: Anyway, this story is associated with the sky realm. Maybe they were normal people or maybe they were wild men. Discuss in the comments or save it for your monster rating. So what about the qualities of it that are similar to the UFO stuff? What about the, okay, so in the air, let's go to the airships, okay, in the US. There are stories associated with the airship things in the late 1800s. So this is pre-Wright Brothers, okay. They steal a cow that is then found towns over parts of the cow, including part that is the hide, where it's branded. So they know it was from this farmer that saw the cow taken by the airship. In fact, I think the farmer was this Alexander Hamilton. That's not the same Alexander Hamilton. And so they have a rope on the cow and they're trying to hold onto it. And I'm sorry, the ship, this is very true, okay. The ship has a rope on the cow that doesn't, and it's trying to pull the cow. And the guy Alexander Hamilton cuts the rope. If I'm just telling this, it's almost better because this is how these things spread. Cuts the rope and then he's like, okay, good. Now it can't take my cow. And then it takes the cow anyway, somehow, like I guess on its tractor beam. Like it throws the rope on it to hold it still while it locks the tractor beam on. And then it's got to take it. And then it takes the cow. And then he finds it talons over. He finds some leather, well, would be leather eventually. He finds it's hide with the brand still on it. And no, the rest of the cows gone. Now the explanation is obviously that they needed it to go with their root crops.
WDG: Well, they were probably making some beef stew or something like that. They needed some beef, some potatoes, some carrots.
Baba: It's incomplete otherwise. And it's hard to raise cattle up in the sky. Contrary to Johnny Cash's, it's hard to catch cattle in the sky
WDG: because there aren't any orders. About this kind of stuff, about these things, this person obviously knows what a rope is. This is like, this is the 1800s. He knows what ships are and he knows what things, it's like they have this idea. But this thing is-- He knows what probably metal ships are. It's like, we're getting into that point where we've had in some war metal actual ships and stuff like that. I mean, so there's like, but again, okay, it's a cigar shaped--
Baba: Well, exactly, right? So now it's more like a submarine going through the sky. It was wearing around before apparently.
WDG: But the whole idea of, well, there was, there is some submarine, like early submarine like tech, coming out of people like, I think revolutionary war and like early, it was almost like a glorified barrel, with like, you can put a little charge under a boat. So there was like people working that stuff, some of that out in submarine, but I wouldn't, I don't think they'd call, I don't think most people would.
Baba: Yeah, well, it wasn't in popular consciousness yet.
WDG: No, not Jules. And we'd like to have stories of barrels floating through. Not to like Jules, you know, like, you know, to like 20,000 leagues and stuff like that, you know. Right. But it's, but the, but okay, so like, but like again--
Baba: So like why the rope? Why the anchor? Like if you could take it without the rope, why was the rope there?
WDG: Yeah, but it was like, so there's just like--
Baba: And that's where it's like, it's not what it seems to be.
WDG: Yeah, that's like, that's basically the thing like, I don't know, it's--
Baba: And like, why would it be in the story other? Like why put that detail in there if it was just gonna take it away otherwise? Like, you know what I mean?
WDG: Yeah, it doesn't seem like it adds a lot of-- If it makes, if you pick it up the story-- It would actually make it feel less credible, I don't know, or it's just like, or like it's like they were harpooning it, right? Like it was like a rope, but they were really like trying to, I don't know, whatever. Like, so it's like, because it's like sky, air, whatever, like what are they, but there's just this thing where, I don't know, I feel like aliens are more just another variant of folklore that they're not these, sort of like, you know, like, it's just like, if this stuff is weird and this stuff does happen, but it's all weird stuff that doesn't make sense, it's like, this is not high tech in a sense, and this is not like, low tech, like it's like this, and they say, you know, it's like, it's high tech in a weird, like, like almost like fantasy sense, but it's like, it's not very, like things just seem weird, like people understand and know what things look like, they wouldn't, like, you know, I think it was like a flying saucer, right, like UFO, like people have seen plates and saucers, they would be able to describe them that way, like, they would know what disc, like, what like disc shapes are or things like that.
Baba: And that's the thing, like, yeah, like, You know, you take it, you know, it's like, One of the earliest descriptions, okay, so we've got the description of these things flying like a saucer, and that I believe is like 1900s, but we also have stories, where are you, Japanese story, of these things that are flying through that are equated with being similar to like terra cotta, well, not terra cotta, anyway, these clay, these Japanese clay dishes. So it's like a similar kind of description of like, like some kind of a kitchen vessel, some kind of a kitchen vessel, you know, throw back anyone to Baba Yaga, the mortar and pestle. Why is she floating around in that? That doesn't make any sense. People do call shenanigans on the Alexander Hamilton story, by the way, but the idea that these air visitors captured a cow, like it's that early in, like before we have cattle mutilations, like I don't think someone was flipping through the old literature and be like, oh, this one, this is a believable one. So like the idea of it mutilating cattle, but then it's kind of like, well, and here I was negligent in my research, believe it or not, I was negligent in my research. I didn't research cattle mutilation itself to see, have these things often been attributed to something supernatural? I know witches get blamed for killing cattle.
WDG: Yeah, also witches fly around in the sky.
Baba: Well, and that's what I'm talking about. Like a lot of it, it gets associated with these things that come from the sky. Chupacabra kills goats. Chupacabra comes from the sky. Vampires are from, well, they're not from the sky, but they come from the sky. Similar kind of, I'll get ahead of myself because I'm not sure how much of that is just like post Bram Stoker, like turning into bats and things. It's not just fear of bats, right? Why do these things come from the sky? Why is heaven up in the sky? Why is it under the ground? Doesn't it make sense? That's where we bury people. Isn't that where the dead would be? Why are they in the sky?
WDG: It used to be the case. Does the sun's there? It used to be the gods were in the sky and like the underworld where souls went was in the ground, right? Yeah, like once we-- And the favor realm was in the ground, right?
Baba: You know what it is? It's the stars. It's the stars. That's why, yeah. It's like that's where the ancestors go when they die. Might as well talk about the pancakes on the farms and what have I been, what's the big reveal I've been waiting for? All right, so 1961, the alien pancake encounter. So chicken farmer named Joe Simonton and this is in Eagle River, Wisconsin. And he witnessed aliens cooking on a grill in their craft. And then he was offered a pancake like food and later gave it to authorities to test it. Who found it was made of buckwheat and curiously it contained no salt. I remember that little detail. Yeah, they were about five foot tall. They were cooking on a flameless grill and they handed him this greasy three inch perforated pancake. And he said it tasted like cardboard. They're divided opinions on whether you should eat food given to you by strange creatures.
Danny C: Or strangers in general, probably.
Baba: Or strangers in general.
WDG: Especially like, so their craft had to be parked and open or was it like an open air craft if they're grilling? I'm kind of like, I don't understand the, like this guy, like he said they saw them in a ship. Yeah. I guess the ship had, was landed, right? And it was open.
Baba: There was a silver, yeah.
WDG: And they were in the ship grilling? No, no, they came out. They were out of the ship and they brought the grill out. So they were camping. So basically aliens are just like, what do they call it when you're like camping but it's really high end camping? Lamping. Yes. (Laughing)
Baba: Yeah. Kinda. With their buckwheat pancakes. Some of them. They didn't have bland marshmallows.
WDG: They were like, they had a gluten intolerance or something like that as I went with buckwheat pancakes. Like they would, you know what I'm saying?
Baba: Yeah, I mean, maybe it's stores better as a grain. Yeah. Yeah, maybe they don't have those pests, you know? Yeah. Maybe they got it by raiding a field and they didn't have any root crops and they just had buckwheat. And I'm like, well, I guess we'll mash this into something, roll it out, squash it into a pancake. That does seem like a very bizarre. That's what I mean.
WDG: These things don't make sense. It doesn't feel very, it feels like alienated in a sense but also it doesn't feel very like, again, none of these stories feel like this high tech intergalactic type of thing. It feels very clumsy, like, you know, oh, our ship broke down. Oh, we dropped the cow.
Baba: Yeah, my leprechaun clothes are too big.
WDG: Yeah, exactly.
Baba: Like there's something like that. My musket isn't something that would actually work.
WDG: Yeah.
Baba: You know, I came here in a boat that definitely wouldn't stay up there. Why do these stories contain these stupid ideas? You know, and like part of it is kind of like, maybe it's just stretches, maybe it's so they're not quite credible. Like what if the thing is showing up in a way with these incredible things going on? So as to strain the edges of credibility, but like so that the story almost can't be believed. What if they are the tall tales? They will go back to that. The tall tales of their, of all of time, they're just there to make it up and spread rumors. But that, and then get people to argue over whether it really happened. They're here to ruin reputations.
WDG: It's kind of bizarre, but it's like reputations of like just normal people that probably didn't have much of a reputation to begin with.
Baba: I mean, the thing is sometimes these things have real life things that happen that are quite sinister. You know, and so that's where it's like, some of these are just silly because like, often because the details are curious. Like I remember like, there's a story about someone that has a Bigfoot encounter. And like the story begins with like, they, I think they like hear some, no, they don't hear something. They just like, they want to see if someone's in this, cave, so they fire an arrow into it. And then the arrow flies back. It's like, well, again, it doesn't make sense because nothing is described later as having a bow and arrow to have been able to fire an arrow back. But also why would you, why would that be how you checked if anybody was in there?
WDG: Yeah, cause like, oh no, like, somebody comes out, he has an arrow stuck through. He's like, I was just, I was just in this cave. Have you heard of spillunking? Like, I'm just like,
Baba: They could have been eating anything, you know? You could have said you just ate the thing. Like you didn't have to present evidence at a time in history where someone could actually look at it and find out what it is, you know?
WDG: Also, it's not like buckwheat pancakes are that bizarre. I mean, it's like, it's not a,
Baba: it's all like a-- I mean, what's the hardest why you would make them, why you wouldn't include salt? And like, did these things include egg or something? Like, how did you bind that together? Were they chicken eggs? I mean, like, it's early for things like--
WDG: You did say the cow was a chicken farmer, so maybe they were coming to get some eggs for their pancakes, you know?
Baba: Well, if I-- You know what, that's very astute of you, Mr. Holmes. Maybe they did need eggs to get everything to stick together and that's why they were out because the chickens weren't in the ship.
WDG: These are just like the weirdest, like, you know, kind of like, I guess like, you know, I mean, history is repeat with like, you know, certain cultures being more, you know, using colonialism to expand their gourmet palates. Maybe this is just another part of that, you know, like it's like, oh, well, we didn't have these vegetables on our realm of existence over here. And still, you know, it's like us with like pineapples, you know, like pineapples are worth like a fortune, you know, back in the, you know, like early days of exploration because they were hard to transport and they were very kind of rare and like, you know, it'd basically be the equivalent of like buying a house, you know, like, it's like, so all the wealthiest people had them and it's like, but you know, it's
Baba: like-- And it'll be that way again soon.
WDG: Yeah. (Laughs) Now you can get a pineapple for a dollar. It's like, you know, 50 if you're lucky.
Baba: Not for long, not for long.
WDG: For like, you know, or like coffee and-- You'll have to take an air trip to go get one. Yeah. So they said these guys were like five, but four foot or five foot or something. How did these describe else, how they looked like this pancake guy? This is pretty recent, so.
Baba: They look like short, stocky Italians. Is that what it said?
WDG: That's still-- That's what this guy, it's like, so good.
Baba: So, okay, so rather than-- What, what does that mean? Little three men and more greys that were popular in modern, in media, right? In modern, in the tales of the times because this is like post Roswell and all. He described them as three small men who reminded him of short, stocky Italians.
WDG: That's a very bizarre, like, and specifically like-- Their
Baba: faces were hairless. Although they possessed an intense gaze that made him kind of look away. Like, be ashamed if something happened. Something happened to your farm. (Laughing) That's like-- Give us some eggs for our plan. Thank you. But they seemed to be kind of nice. They were dressed identically in tight-fitting one-piece tunics. A black tunics made of material that looked like Jersey. They had noticeable buttons or zippers and included knit-type hats and hoods pulled over their heads which obscured whether they had hair. (Applause)
WDG: So these guys are just like-- This is a freakin' strange story. So these are some short guys that vaguely look some kind of like-- Crooked pancakes and got a flameless grill. Yeah, like wearing little, like wearing little beady hats and onesies, essentially. Yeah, like-- Why, right? Yeah, that's a very strange--
Baba: Let's stop with the silly theories of these being made up stories. Okay, let's dispense with all that. All you skeptics, why the hell are you still here? Are you kidding me? Are you still here?
WDG: I'm here for the short, stocky, knit-cap guys.
Baba: Let's see if they got mentioned. Yeah. All right, so-- Hang on a second. We dispense with the idea that these are just made up stories. Okay, we've got these things are what they appear to be or they aren't what they appear to be. Is there something non-physical that can appear physically? Hence it's not how it appears. And we, it purposely looks in a way to try to best approximate something we would understand. Like so in other words, it's like, oh, let me take on a physical appearance. Here we go, that's the best I could do. You know, or we're encountering something. We don't know what it is. So our brain makes up something, says it's kind of like this. It's something like this. And if it's option two, is it purposely making it a mismatch? Because it's like, okay, look, now these are my air quotes, okay? It's not really a boat. You wouldn't be, you know this, you've seen these. It's like, is it putting these weird things in there to let you know this isn't what it really is? These are the air quotes.
WDG: Let me jump to the assumption like that this is something that's happening, right? Or there's something, like you said, something that we don't understand. What if it's like kind of like when, which we're notorious for mispronouncing foreign words. What if it's like somebody trying to speak a language they're unfamiliar with, right? Like that's like, you know, it's like there's, it's gonna come out and jumble. It's gonna come out and jumble, then it's not gonna make sense. Like it's just like, oh, well yeah, like this is how this is supposed to look right. I like, not you thinking it doesn't quite look like a boat. It's like, they don't really know what a boat looks like. And they're trying to be like, this is a boat. It's like, right?
Baba: That's what I mean with option one. That like, that's kind of like, oh, I need, I want to interact with these people. I'm gonna show up. Oh, this is what people wear, right? But it's a leprechaun and it's one too big and its features are weird. Cause no, that's not what people really look like. That's not the right size. Just doesn't quite get it. Those definitely are off. Yeah. Is it like an imprecise thing on behalf of the creature? I say creature, or is it a lack of precision on our part? Is it a perception thing? Is it a projection thing from their side? Is it a how they show up? Or like you said, like the language thing, like they're jumbling the language of showing up in our sensory range, you know? Or is our sensory range just ill-equipped to perceive something there? And so it's making something up, which we know, okay, even if we step back into what we quote unquote, know scientifically, I mean, that there are certain disorders where this will happen, where people will, sometimes it's like literally like there's a blind spot. I believe it might have a, be a problem with the visual cortex, where the blind spot will get filled with this jumbled information. That's like not really there, like it hallucinates something. We know that the mind will do that already. So if there's some kind of anomaly out there, it won't, it can't perceive, we'll just fill in the details. Is that what's going on? You know, or like that, or is it the other thing? The thing is doing its best to show up in a certain way, or it's purposely showing up in a weird way. So it's like,
WDG: just a mess between.
Baba: You know what I mean?
WDG: Yeah. Well, I mean, I guess if I'm gonna go into the idea of like the trickster-ish kind of vibe that a lot of this, these types of sort of, at least in the pre-UFO phenomenon idea was about, you know, like the leprechauns, the goblins, the thing, you know, they're like these kind of like, yeah, it's like, they're there to mess with people in a sense. Like, you know, there's like, you know, there's kind of like a, yeah.
Baba: And so then it's, yeah, like, is it like, why is that pancakes?
WDG: What's that? Why the pancakes?
Baba: What, and that's the thing, like, why like this strange elements of the story? Like, remember we were talking about like Mothman, and like the wings clearly are not big enough to fly, but that element is there and it's kind of like, well, why is that strange? Now like that, you could say, well, because people are like repeating the story, they just don't know that when they're making up the story, you know, but it's those things like when the pancakes show up that it's like, or like the rope with the cow, why would you make up that story? Like, okay, so like some people it's like the men in black, right? Sometimes like men in black show up and it's like, well, there's some kind of government people and they're there to scare people from telling the story, the truth about extraterrestrials or the truth about government experiments or whatever. They're there to scare people to keep them quiet. But there are actually instances where like they just don't seem to be human. Like they don't seem to make sense. Like I remember a story I read somewhere about like, one of these guys came in and like, he had like kind of a strange appearance to him. Like you, it's kind of weird looking. So he comes in, he's got this strange appearance and he, I'm just doing it for the algorithm people. He eats a bowl of jelly, like grape jelly. He just eats a straight up bowl of jelly. And it's like, that's really bizarre behavior. Like what, why would you do that? Like, cause like, you know what I would do if I were trying to intimidate somebody? I'd like bring in like a little like this tiny little baseball bat, you know? Cause it's easy to conceal. Or because I'm only three foot feet tall and I'm one of these, the stocky Italian type man in black, right? And I'm gonna smash up their China closet. I'm gonna be like, say anything, I'll be back, right? You intimidate somebody like you don't go into their kitchen. You don't go into their kitchen and eat a bowl of jelly and be like, you know what? Don't mess with us.
WDG: That's right. So it's like, did the guy pull jelly out of the fridge and then just-- He has her jelly.
Baba: Yeah. I think it was a woman that he was visiting.
WDG: But it's like, you know, but it's like, and they put jelly just into a bowl. Like that's a weird-- Seems like it.
Baba: That's just a-- Just some further inconvenience to the person. They're not just gonna eat the whole jar of jelly.
WDG: They're gonna leave like a bowl, like a dirty bowl.
Baba: You gotta make pancakes out of, you're not gonna include any salt. I mean, they put the sugar right into it. So maybe that's how it is together if that like caramelized.
WDG: We said you also added some kind of oil, like fat. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's a hydrogen fat.
Baba: So yeah, that would disperse the heat throughout it too, which would be kind of useful.
WDG: It's kind of those box pancakes where all you have to do is add oil, no egg, you know?
Baba: I think it's funny, like this idea of this, these earth crops, agricultural and rural products, like cattle products and goat products, that these sky beings are into. Why? And again, it's like, if you're a farmer, you know when it was killed by a coyote. There's no reason to go making up a story.
WDG: Unless you've regionally lived somewhere where there's no coyotes.
Baba: And that's what I'm saying, like where it's kind of like, like a lot of these things, it's like, oh, well no, it's like this other kind of predator. And it's like, yeah, but like it's blood strained. And it's like, yeah, well, no, it got mange or something. Like something happened to it. It got shriveled up. Like I said, well, you know, so there are these, we haven't gotten into Chupacabra yet. So I'm speaking outside of my-- Yeah, save that for the Chupacabra episode. Yeah, but like, but that's kind of the thing where it's like, yeah, check in the links for our Chupacabra episode coming soon. Why the sky stuff? Why is it so, why are the cattle things, this is the quiet, oh, I'm bringing up Chupacabra. Why are they associated with things that fly instead of things that are on the land? Like why add that detail if you're making stuff up? Because we don't know of sky predators that kill cattle. We probably know about them by now, you know, unless they weren't from here. And so the Magonia thing, so, okay, so one idea is there's this, there are these beings that are purposely showing up, or we're encountering these beings that are there, and by some other apparatus, we're perceiving them, or they're exactly what they appear to be. They just have ways of making those types of things float and things like that. They like their clothes like that. So there's some explanations. Another one is, so there are these beings that are showing up that are like visitors, right? They're visitors, they're here to visit. There's another one that's like, now there's this reality that we bump into now and then, and when the conditions are right, we just wind up with these strange, you know, when the stars are right, not only can Cthulhu wake up, when the stars are right that we can accidentally walk into like the Fay village or whatever. And that works that way, you know, or, or that we can otherwise perceive this reality that's already there all the time, you know, but something happens that allows us to perceive it, you know, so there's weird kinds of ways to account for it, but none of them are entirely satisfactory, nor is just the explanation that all of this stuff is just made up, or that it's just made up by dumb people, or people that want attention, you know, because again, like when you're a cop, how many points does it get you with your fellow rural cops that you're the one with the space alien story? And like, how many points? Okay, so then it's like, well, no, you're just, you're perceiving something, but you're misinformed. But then like the details that are added in that don't make sense, don't make sense. You know, there's always this, something doesn't always jive, including that it's just exactly what it seems to be.
WDG: How many, like, let's just like set aside the alien thing. Well, let's just call this stuff like other stuff, like others or other, you know, like your, whatever it is, whether it doesn't matter why it happens, right? How many people you think have some more of these weird things and just don't say anything because it would be bizarre, like, was I dreaming this, or did this happen? Like, I don't know, it's just like, it's an interesting, or I'd be like a position where it's like, yeah, I don't really feel like my reputation as, you know, I don't know, like a legal counselor, because I happened to be hugging one day and a bunch of short dude stupid black offered me a pancake. You know, in the middle of like that, that looked bizarre and yeah, it was weird. Maybe I just don't tell anybody that because that's a little strange, you know, yeah. Or like you said, like, I have some position of authority or something like that, there's nothing to, you know, to, you know, lose a lot more than you're gonna gain by, you know, driving yourself.
Baba: And that's the thing, a lot of times these folks are, they're religious and stuff like that. It's not getting them any points, you know, like when we talk about like a ghost story type stuff and things like that, like it's like, it's not winning them any points with the community when they do these kinds of things, if they're making it up, right? And so like, it's just baffling, but yeah, so Magonia and it's, we barely opened a can of worms on this stuff. I wish I did have time to read this novella on the Polish encounter. Oh, we should talk about one more thing, which is there's a guy named Steven Greer and they have this thing, he's a contemporary author, I believe. And he, there are these things they call CE5 or Close Encounters of the Fifth Kind.
WDG: Do you know the rundown of the different kinds, you know, like what the encounters are? Do you know them?
Baba: First is a visual sighting of a UFO at close range. Second is a UFO encounter that leaves physical evidence. So crop circles and things would be in that category. Burns, broken branches, things like that. Third kind involves the observation of animated beings. So humanoids are aliens. So are pancake guy. In or around the UFO. Yeah, you don't necessarily have to interact with them. Okay. Fourth kind is being abducted or taken aboard a craft. And fifth kind is direct intentional communication between humans and extraterrestrials. So Steven Greer and company have a way of I won't make claims either way. I don't know enough about it. It's called CE5. You can look them up. It's Steven with a V as in Victor or as in a letter in the middle of Steven. And yeah, CE5 for summoning aliens. Back to our friend, Alister Crowley, since we mentioned the burlesque house earlier. Sometimes described some of the beings he encountered as being extraterrestrial, which some people have have associated with space aliens specifically, not like elementals or things. And finally, Jack Parsons, I believe the inventor of solid state fuel. Jack Parsons of Jet Propulsion Labs was a Thelemite, a disciple of Alister Crowley's and used to, I believe recite the hymn of pan before rocket launches. So, and died under mysterious circumstances. There you go. You thought you were getting one can of worms? Oh, right. There we go. Oh, yeah.
WDG: That's a, gotta love the mysterious.
Baba: We gotta get out of here people. I gotta go meet with the Magonians to give them some carrots. Do you think these things are scary? I think they're weird. I think I'm back to, I've rated exactly the same as I do with the crop circles.
WDG: But what are we gonna, let me just say, is this a like weird, like, if you see a Magonian, would you be freaked out? Like, you know, I guess, or would you be like, yeah.
Baba: You know, I guess it depends what you consider them to be. Okay, let me do it like this. If they're the same thing as Fay, yeah, actually. I do think they're kind of scary, because actually they're quite unpredictable. And the effects range anything from grabbing you up and taking you away or killing you, leaving your skin somewhere with the brand visible.
WDG: I get the trees, no.
Baba: Yeah, how you, yeah. So that's pretty scary. So since I feel like I should give a monster rating, I'm gonna say that's pretty scary. But since they are Magonian, if they're the same ones that have these pancakes, they can be kept aside with salt. So I'm only gonna give them four. All right, someone else vote. Everybody's, everyone that's still here is tired.
WDG: Come on, man, give it a cry for too long. Frap up some final thoughts here.
Baba: He knows too much inside information about it.
Danny C: I know too much inside information.
WDG: His airship is parked outside, you know? I mean, like, that's why his background is blurry, because the airship's.
Danny C: I still have to get that in short, so be cool, man, be cool. I'm gonna start right off with the rating. I'm giving this a lowly rating of a one. To me, this just rings of story. I don't think there is anything to it. It just, it doesn't make sense to me, you know? These beings from the sky, they want potatoes or root vegetables if you wanna be a little more generic. It just doesn't make sense. Like, I, it just seems too ridiculous. Like, you can, you have these ships that can fly, okay? Sail through the air, but you need potatoes? It just seems too ridiculous that they've mastered the art of flying in the sky, but they haven't figured out a way to grow a root potato, a root vegetable, rather, in this ship. I think they can figure that out if they had to. I think they could create containers big enough that it could support the root. I don't know, we just, maybe that's my own ignorance.
Baba: Maybe it's because they're above the rain, you know?
Danny C: Maybe it's my own ignorance, you know, with how farming works, I don't know, but it just, it doesn't make sense to me. It seems just too ridiculous.
Baba: If you didn't know how farmers were farming work, you'd know that keeping your crop was based on paying off tempest story. I'm gonna sum up what you said in my own words, okay? You 100% believe the story, but you think the Magonians are doing it because they think it's funny. You only give it one monster, not because you don't believe it, because you don't think it's scary when people from sky realms, stocky Italians from the sky realms, come and steal your potatoes. You also don't think it's scary, because you're not terribly into root crops. I can tell, you're skin and bones.
Danny C: I was gonna mention this earlier, I was gonna mention this earlier actually, but I did not. I have three possible scenarios, three possible explanations for what this really is. One, they are in fact extraterrestrials, and this is more of a coming of age moment, you know, where they have to come to earth, and they have to do something, it's like a dare kind of, you know? Yeah, like it's a frat.
Baba: That's an explanation number one. That's the root crops, the crop circles too, that's a graffiti.
Danny C: Number two, number two, is that they have to dress oddly or present something that's out of character, because it's their way of showing like, hey, we're cool, we're all powerful, we can annihilate you, but it's okay, we have this musket that doesn't work, you know? It's cool, we're cool. So that's number two. And the third one is that it's all just nonsense, and people are looking for the 10 minutes of fame.
Baba: Yeah, and people drink a lot in the country. They do. Yeah, that. But regardless, one. Number one. Yeah, what? Monster, one monster, one monster.
WDG: Yeah, it's like, I think, I mean, this is definitely like, Magonia itself feels like very, you know, it's a very regional thing, right? You know, it's like to this day. When you get into the thing about the tithing thing, which I didn't know about, like, I wonder if you said those villagers just didn't want to pay their tithing, and they were making it. (Laughs) I was just like, oh, it's-- Look, we all gotta stick together on this.
Baba: And the four that were in the cage were the ones that were gonna be like, now look, we just gotta tithe. They're dirty, because they got their
WDG: focuses kicked. Yeah, they just like, or they were just like, you know, they were from another town, they were like starving, because they gave all their stuff to tithing, and now they had no food for themselves, so they were like, they wandered and left, and they were, and it's like, but I mean, yeah, it just, it feels like they just like, and the idea that they were paying off the, like, we don't have this crop, because we were paying off the Magonians, it's like--
Baba: That's a church, if you want better representation on our podcast, it's time for you to pay off.
WDG: That was pretty, that was pretty, you know, pretty, I don't know how, I mean, like, my understanding of like tithing, especially like medieval times, it's a tax, it's not really like, you didn't really get a choice, it's not like, oh, I'm doing this because I love the church and really believe in it, it was kind of like, you gotta pay, you know, so there's like, so there is an element where I feel like--
Baba: But it wasn't like that money came out of your paycheck, like it was kind of like, there were records figuring out, you know what I mean? Yeah, but it still was like,
WDG: you have to pay up, you have to claim things and yeah. Yeah, you have to show like, you're giving your money.
Baba: Yeah, it's like a compulsory thing, is what you're saying, rather than--
WDG: Yeah, it wasn't a, yeah, it wasn't like kind of like, something that in like modern, like, you know, variations of churches that practice this, where it's more of a charitable-- Put it in an envelope, you know. Yeah, optional kind of thing. You're not allowed to make the right communities. Right, but it's, so it does feel like, there does feel like some kind of like, element of like, it's pretty convenient, to get away from paying your like, taxes essentially. (Laughs) Yeah, yeah. You know, in that sense. Now, as far as like, if I did see a bunch of weird earthships or layerships come from the sky, not earthships that are on the earth, but the, that would be weird, I guess. Like, so if I was trying to like, suspend some disbelief, like, and just, and go in into it that way. So I'll give it a two, I'll square there, because like, if I were just to go out and see a bunch of like, guy throw a rope, steal my cow and like, (Laughs) like, or like, weird guys offering me pancakes, I would probably be just a little weirded out by the whole thing. I would like, I don't know that I would tell a lot of people about it, but I would definitely be weirded out. But as far as the Megonia thing, I feel like it's definitely more like, feels kind of regional and it feels like a way getting out of, out of stuff, you know. It's like, we're explaining like, oh no, I didn't have enough crops. I sold more of them because the Megodians still, so. You know, it just feels like that kind of story. So I'll give it a two. I'll bump one up above, above you Dan, and a little down, find the middle ground here.
Danny C: I also wanna add real quick, it did not get you out of tithing back then, it will not get you out of taxes now, so don't try it now.
WDG: I say try it, like, you know. (Laughs)
Baba: I would try it if you can do the CE5 stuff, where you can,
WDG: Well, I think it's called, I think it's a CE5 1040 that you have to fill out if you're gonna clean Megonia.
Baba: Yeah, right. Megonia encounters.
WDG: Oh, that stuff's always changing. It's like, you'll still have to pay something, but you'll get at least a bit of a discount, you know. (Laughs)
Baba: We get to talk about the optical illusions of cities in the sky, because we just went everywhere else. There's also a cool little story about, like a battle of airships in like the 1500s over Nuremberg. That sounds a lot like a dog fight. And that like, to me, it's kinda like, was that visions of dog fights in the distant future? Like, you know what I mean? Like, it's a cool little story, but there's so much when it comes to sky phenomena. We'll have to make sure next time our topic is like nice and concise and scary too. But you know, in a scary world out there, Sometimes it's good. It's fun just to have a pancake with weird humanoids in your backyard.